From The Times:
Northern Rock, the Government-owned lender, has announced that it is pulling all its tracker deals for homeowners and landlords and is expected to increase rates when it relaunches the mortgages later this week. It follows a move by Abbey earlier today to increase interest rates on tracker deals by up to 0.5 percentage points.
Umbongo alerted me, in the comments a couple of posts ago, to this fine summary by Paul Krugman, written back in 1999. I can't claim to understand the jargon, but in it he points out that once a depression/recession gets bad enough, cutting interest rates - even to zero - does not stimulate the real economy, what clever economists refer to as 'The liquidity trap'.
This is all well and good in theory*, but there are three far more fundamental and practical points.
1. To the average borrower, the BoE base rate is completely irrelevant. What matters is the rate that you pay on your mortgage, overdraft, credit card, business loan etc. And real interest rates are basically [inflation + risk free interest rate + risk premium]. Future inflation is anybody's guess - call it 5%. The risk free rate, for UK purposes is the rate that you can earn on UK index-linked government bonds, about 1%. And the risk premium must be at least 1% on top of that, even for a really well run business or a mortgage with only 50%LTV. So nobody is going to lend anybody money for less than 7%. The banks have been pretty stupid over the past few years but they are now learning fast. This is the basic 'cutting BoE rates is like pushing a piece of string' theory.
2. To the average borrower, the interest rate is less important than the total amount the bank will lend him (or her). Whether a profitable business has to pay 8% or 9% on its overdraft is neither here nor, and the same goes for any half-way sensible buy-to-let landlord. What puts businesses out of business is when all of a sudden the bank calls in its loans or cuts the overdraft facility. What is forcing the not-so-sensible buy-to-let landlord to sell up is when the bank decides that a LTV of 90% is too risky and that in future they won't rearrange a loan with an LTV of more than 80%. All of a sudden, said landlord has to stump up 10% of the value of all his or her properties in cash (a 'margin call'). Which ain't going to happen, obviously. Leading to forced sales, further falls in values, further margin calls etc. (and hurray to that, as it happens)
3. Ask yourself why banks are reigning in credit and hoarding cash. It's because they in turn have their bondholders (aka the money markets, aka holders of mortgage backed securities) snapping at their heels asking for their money back. The quickest and fairest way to fix this is debt-for-equity swaps. Such swaps do not cancel a liability (which would be ungentlemanly), they merely convert a short term claim against the bank into a longer term right to participate in future profits of the bank, thus taking the heat off the bank, who in turn can take the heat of the business in need of finance etc.
Here endeth.
* Paul Krugman's theory (sort of) predicted what would happen in Japan over the intervening years; basically Japanese savers would invest abroad in search of higher returns. This is the far more sophisticated 'cutting BoE rates is like pushing a piece of string' theory. And then the Japanese savers went one better and borrowed cheaply in JPY to invest in higher yielding currencies, like AUD. Which worked fine for those prepared to gamble on the 'carry trade', until it suddenly all went pop. But Japan is a country where the government can actually control the interest rate charged to borrowers. We are, luckily, a long way from that here.
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2 hours ago
18 comments:
Agreed. Regarding point 1 I think this is reflecting a basic misunderstanding of economics (not in you, but in the people who whine about banks not reducing rates). Market prices are set by supply and demand, and thus a mortgage rate is high when lots of people want to borrow and not many want to lend. As in, right now.
Far too many clowns, such as Gordon, think prices are cost-plus and therefore if the funding costs for the banks at BoE go down, then mortgage rates do too. The fact competitive markets usually bid down prices to something closely related to cost does not mean cost is the driver.
Irrespective of the complexities, basic economics ought to teach these clowns that when banks don't wanna supply credit, rates go up.
Prepare for the New World Economic Order
Interest Rates [Credit] are the Cause and Consequence of the Explosion of Income/Wealth Disparities and, Hence, of the Inherent Instability ofthis Economy:
The Ominous Keynes' Liquidity Trap.
Everyone Need an Economy, Don't They?
There Is One Solution That Works:
A Credit Free, Free Market Economy:
The New World Economic Order.
The Only Goal of 1776 - Annuit Cœptis is to Implement It.
They Can Transfer Their Assets & Forget Their Liabilities.
Anyone Can Join But Still Needs to Ask for It.
http://www.17-76.net/
The Purpose Is to Provide Both a New Deal and a New Game.
It is NOT to Fix This Economy Which is Already Beyond Repair.
The Intention Is to Create a New Economy
With the Assets of the Old One Without its Liabilities.
Why Not Insure Against the Worst Case Scenario?
I'm not sure I entirely agree with Mr Von Mises.
Interaction of supply and demand is part of the picture, but only part. The banks are not increasing rates purely out of a desire to maximise profits when selling a scarce resource - they know to do so is politically risky with such an interventionist government.
More important, I believe, is that their desire to make "A" profit, whether or not it is the maximum profit they could achieve.
They operated on too narrow margins for too long which, combined with taking inadequate security, left them in a real pickle. They need to restore themselves to profit by increasing their margin. But they also know they must be able to justify it to prevent the government taking draconian measures against them.
That doesn't mean they are setting their lending rates purely on a cost-plus basis, but it does mean they can justify their actions by use of a cost-plus analysis. In effect they can say "we had to increase rates because we were making a loss, we have increased them by the minimum amount needed to make our business profitable."
The dichotomy, if you like, is between the pricing of risk and profitability.
The banks underpriced for risk. They have lost shed loads of money on bad loan deals of every type. They have made those losses. Their balance sheets are shot to pieces and as MW correctly points out they are being pursued by their own creditors.
Of the loans they have made some will be bad, but the majority won't be. However they don't know at the moment which is which. (Actually they do. Any good local old fashioned bank manager could have told you who was going to default and who was not - but they've sacked all those and lost that experience so they're screwed.) So if they don't know which is which they raise the risk premium on all of them. This of course does not mean that they are making profits, so they also have to raise the rate some more to make a profit on that loan.
But that is not all because they are still not making a profit as a business, and they have to rebuild their balance sheets. So they add a little bit more to the rate charged to make their businesses profitable and rebuild their balance sheets - at the expense of ours.
It is this last component that is one that is disagreeable. Why should they do this? Well, because they can and always have. They are a de facto cartel. Only by allowing them to fail will they stop being free to do this.
In the meantime severely reducing rates whilst doing little or nothing to push the UK out of recession will at least allow the banks to rebuild their balance sheets at lower cost to us. For borrowers a 4% bank margin on 1% base rates is better than a 2% margin on 5% base rates. (Actually most loan agreements contain a minimum interest rate of about 3%).
This is the prime reason I can see for a massive cut in base rates. It helps the banks.
But at the same time it will discourage savers which will hurt the banks. So low interest rates need to be combined with debt/equity swaps. And this won't happen whilst the Great Wanking Gordo is running about shelling out shed loads of our money. (Which is an entirely different thing to the BoE acting as lender of last resort.)
Anyway that's my current thinking at 09.00 a.m. It may different by 09.10!
...something else has just occured to me, the power of the interweb.
This was successfully deployed to counter the illegal bank charges, it might just allow 'us' - everyone who isn't a banker or a bureaucrat - to band together in the same way. A giant co-ordinated and legally argued interest rate strike could work!
Lola, good points, but are you sure that banks (ignoring the credit squeeze is hitting them as well) aren't profitable?
AFAICS they are in rude financial health, the write downs that they'll have to make are less than a year's full profits, for example.
MW - No, I am not at all sure, but my logic is correct. If they are in good financial health profitswise then they will use the overcharging to rebuild their balance sheets. This latter may be a Good Thing. They are going to overcharge anyway, so get the BoE to help out us poor debtors.
I see that the new master of RBS has said he wants to break up the business. Good. Excellent. Let's have separation between retail and investment banking. Let's run retail banking as (IMHO) it should be as a much narrower service with much higher capital adequacy. Of course this could easily be as a sub business of a big bank, but it would be supervised in its own right and its assets ring fenced in the event of a crisis. We need a better model for retail banking currently in which business banks do not make any real money. Free banking is a chimera. They should charge for the account service and pay better interest on deposits.
The point of that rant is that out of this nonsense should come better banking.
Banks don't borrow at BoE Base Rate other than if they had to use the "last resort" facility. Neither do Building Societies when they raise money in the markets to lend as mortgages, or when they borrow it from depositors to lend.
And if Mandelson, who was on this yesterday, truly doesn't understand that, then he has no business doing the job he's (allegedly) doing.
Anyone who has a BoE BR Tracker is going to see the full cut, regardless of how much over Base they pay. Anyone taking a repriced Tracker from tomorrow just has to weigh how much over BoE BR they're prepared to pay.
Simple.
Can I be smug for a moment. We have been seeking the best possible long term, preferably full term, trackers for clients for yonks. We could get spreads of 0.5% on these at one time. These clients are now laughing. Best we can get now is about 1.5% (I have not checked for a couple of days though).
On the subject of fixed rate deals you can liken this to a bond (as in a loan stock.) Research shows that the best risk return compromise on bonds is short term, i.e. less than one year term. If you extrapolate this to fixed rate mortgage deals you will never take anything longer than two to three years as the risk of being wrong on the future course of rates rises exponentially. You buy fixed rates for budgetary certainty, not to save money.
You all may recall the very well qualified and experienced financial adviser Gordon Brown recommending 25 year fixed rates to all borrowers about a year ago. What. A. Prat.
FT, that would be a good point, apart from the fact that the BoE's lender-of-last-resort rate is higher than the base rate. As at a year ago it was base rate plus 1%. It may well be more or less than that at the moment. And it bloody well ought to be a lot more, but hey.
L, please keep us updated on the actual rates that actual real life borrowers have to pay, for that is what matters.
You buy fixed rates for budgetary certainty, not to save money Agreed.
Wot formertory says - the banks borrow in the market and only go to the BoE (in theory) when liquidity is short.
Darling pushes the string again by lowering his voice an octave and insisting that the banks give the punters the benefit of the interest cut from the "independent" BoE. The BBC - ever impartial - gets an enraged mortgagor on News 24 to have a go at the banks. God forbid that the BBC should explain why the banks might be unable to cut rates [1].
Unfortunately the banks have to get deposits in the market. Although the banks will probably try to screw domestic savers, they have to borrow internationally as well. As Barclays has found out, overseas lenders can ignore Darling and the BoE and charge the banks what they think £ deposits are worth (ie include a premium on the interest charged to compensate for the high risk of the £ going down the toilet before they get their money back).
MW: sure the banks can recover their profits but they have to get a positive spread on LIBOR: 3-month LIBOR stood at 5.56% after the BoE decision so we're talking, what, 9% minimum for an overdraft (if you can get one).
[1] Apparently Lloyds is going to cut all its variable mortgage rates by the full 1.5%. Is this a coincidence or did that nice Sir Victor Blank agree to something even more loathsome than we imagined over his meal with his friend Gordo?
MW - OK I'll do a check tomorrow and get some typical stuff. I've been getting update emails all day from lenders withdrawing deals, especially trackers. My guess is they've been raising the spreads. (been a bit busy to check)
I should point out that we are a wealth management and financial planning business and that debt (i.e. mortgages) is just part of that. We are not mortgage brokers. Not that there are many of those left!
U, LIBOR has only become important since banks stopped relying on depositors as main source of funding. As they can't all be lending to each other at the same time, I don't think LIBOR is much more relevant than BoE base rate. LIBOR is just a handy measure of how little banks trust each other.
Lloyds must have agreed to something horrendous. They remind me of the most nauseating swot sitting at the front of the class "Ask me! Ask me! I can cut rates to borrowers, sir!" They are totally out of step with everybody else. The fact that HBOS are not saying this suggests that maybe Lloyds are getting a far better deal out of the merger, perhaps?
Something else that always intrigues me is when clients say that they do not want to pay the initial charge or any charge to invest in a unit trust because they don't pay anything to save in a bank.
The fact is that if they save into a bank the charge they pay is the difference between what they lend it to the bank for and what the bank charges for it. This spread is frequently about 3%. Since we use institutional funds for clients that they get into at creation price and have TER's of <0.5% I reckon they get a relative bargain. Furthermore if that fool Brown Darling had not banned short selling the TER's would be even lower due to the profits from stock lending fees.
Going back to mortgage rates I tended to use LIBOR as my reference for banks costs of borrowing. This all went out of the window over the last 6 or so years, but will come back as credit supplies get back to realistic levels. Umbongo is right. Why would a foreign investor lend to a UK bank to support a tanking housing market when Sterling is also heading south - relatively? In a very real sense this rate cut could further reduce the supplies of domestic funds flowing into banks. It might tho' boost equities as yield hungry investors get desparate for income. On the subject of yield I spied another article today extolling the generous yields on some corporate bonds that could be tempting for investors seeking income. WTF? Don't they ever learn? High yield = high risk. Oh well, when it all goes horribly wrong more work for us.
Something else that always intrigues me is when clients say that they do not want to pay the initial charge or any charge to invest in a unit trust because they don't pay anything to save in a bank.
The fact is that if they save into a bank the charge they pay is the difference between what they lend it to the bank for and what the bank charges for it. This spread is frequently about 3%. Since we use institutional funds for clients that they get into at creation price and have TER's of <0.5% I reckon they get a relative bargain. Furthermore if that fool Brown Darling had not banned short selling the TER's would be even lower due to the profits from stock lending fees.
Going back to mortgage rates I tended to use LIBOR as my reference for banks costs of borrowing. This all went out of the window over the last 6 or so years, but will come back as credit supplies get back to realistic levels. Umbongo is right. Why would a foreign investor lend to a UK bank to support a tanking housing market when Sterling is also heading south - relatively? In a very real sense this rate cut could further reduce the supplies of domestic funds flowing into banks. It might tho' boost equities as yield hungry investors get desparate for income. On the subject of yield I spied another article today extolling the generous yields on some corporate bonds that could be tempting for investors seeking income. WTF? Don't they ever learn? High yield = high risk. Oh well, when it all goes horribly wrong more work for us.
Then I stand corrected on the lender-of-last-resort rate. The point still stands, though; politicians "urging" banks to pass on the rate reduction in full is a duplicitous stunt because lenders don't in reality borrow at BoEBR (or even at 1% above it).
L, my advice would be, if you want to invest in shares, do it directly and cut out the UT middle man.
FT, your logic was spot on, I was just quibbling on a minor factual point.
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