From today's Evening Standard (I couldn't find the article online):
Students also fear they will be forced to drop subjects they love in favour of "sensible" courses that will guarantee them a job.
Max Waldron, 22, from Wimbledon is studying for a masters at King's after graduating in politics from Durham. He lives at home with his mother and is already £30,000 in debt. He said: "The days when students chose a subject they loved and enjoyed their degrees are long gone. There is already a sense of urgency now about getting a job. If fees go up, people will have to take jobs they don't like just to pay off their loans."
Mr Wain added: "Fewer people will do subjects like classics and philosophy, which give you transferable skills but not necessarily a definite job. People will get more single-minded and will have to decide what career they want at the age of 18."
PS, before I'm accused of being a hypocrite or laughing at the misfortunes of others, let me also inform you that my parents took me out of school at 15 (for no particular reason - I had a free place at a good grammar school) and I didn't go to university - to do an eminently "sensible" course which I hoped would guarantee me a job - until I had saved up for my own living costs at the age of 27 (although to be fair the fees were subsidised).
I then did two further professional qualifications, which I paid for out of my own money, and finished off by doing a degree part time/in the evenings while doing a full time job (again, to be fair, the fees for this were subsidised. I paid about £125 for each 'unit', i.e. 12 lectures, 12 tutorials and one exam or marked coursework).
Anthologies
3 hours ago
8 comments:
tbh, I cannot for the life of me see the point of taking a degree that wouldn't guarantee me a job or leave me eminently well qualified to do the abundant jobs in my chosen field. Degrees aren't for fun, they are a means to an end and if there's no job at the end of it you've just wasted your time and money.
It's a wonder you've any cash left in the piggy bank.
I have for many years (starting around 3-4 years after I dropped out of a 4-year sandwich course) been of the opinion that it shouldn't be possible to go straight from school to University or equivalent. Many teenagers would find out in that intervening period that the world outside education offers them many possibilities. Most(?) of those that did go on to further full time study would probably have a real desire to learn, and put more in/get more out of it.
And if you don't like the idea of running up a large debt, there's always part time study with the OU. An Honours will cost less than £5k. Plus there's a subsidy to a greater or lesser extent for those earning less than (I think the latest figure is) c£26,000.
It's not an easy option, certainly for the hard (in the context of hard/soft) subjects. You have to go at it from day 1.
I agree :-
"tbh, I cannot for the life of me see the point of taking a degree that wouldn't guarantee me a job or leave me eminently well qualified to do the abundant jobs in my chosen field."
Although I think no degree can guarantee a job.
The only thing I would say however is that people should do degrees with some useful extra courses in case they do not like their major degree or the job market collapses while that are uni.
I did chemistry in the 1990's so I know about the job market changing for the worse in a permanent way while I was at uni.
QM, exactly. I don't think you could ever squeeze the last drop of stupidity out the quotes provided by the ES.
JH, I paid for all this stuff on the reasonable assumption that it would increase my earnings capacity. It has paid itself off many times over in the past fourteen years (even including three years not earning).
VFTS, as a 'mature' student who did it the hard way, I tend to agree, but I'd be lying if I said that I don't bitterly regret not having been allowed to stay on to do A-levels and hence sail into Oxbridge.
"I don't think you could ever squeeze the last drop of stupidity out the quotes provided by the ES"
Cheers for that.
I agree with Mr Wain.If you are not interested in your subject, there is no point in doing it for money (deferred gratification and all that).It is a question of motivation.(When I did a PGCE way back an American psychology major would extinguish all the fond dreams of the lecturers about how teaching methods would work with his catch-phrase "What's the motivation?". The standard reply from the experts was " The student's natural desire to learn" whereupon everybody would collapse in cynical laughter and the lecturer would crack a wry smile.)
yes, well, I did the same as MW - but I wasn't taken out of school - I just messed around. I really should've been 'taken out'. To be frank it's a wonder I wasn't expelled. Nevertheless since doing my own thing I have funded myself through two sets of professional qualifications, engineering and financial services. I have no sympathy for graduates who whinge.
But to share some observations with you I have four daughters, two of whom have taken degrees. Dr1 did a practical degree in marketing with English, and she works in marketing now. Dr4 is reading philosophy and english. Dr4 is a very committed student and loves the whole university experience and is doing a subject she likes (philosophy) principally I think because she likes an argument (now ehere did she inherit that from?). So I see no wrong at all insudying something you love if you want to as long as you appreciate the cost, which she does. BTW all my children are very commercial and I know that Dr4 will be very capable at earning a living.
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