tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post8029553234646834829..comments2024-03-05T10:52:24.691+00:00Comments on Mark Wadsworth: Sport in SchoolsMark Wadsworthhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07733511175178098449noreply@blogger.comBlogger25125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-20408717988403298472014-06-23T13:05:06.710+01:002014-06-23T13:05:06.710+01:00Bayard,
None.
If you've got Olympic events l...Bayard,<br /><br />None.<br /><br />If you've got Olympic events like rowing or yachting, you're mostly going to get posh kids doing them (Steve Redgrave isn't, but the rest of the squad were all at Eton).<br /><br />The medals won by the posh kids were all what can best be described as the "soft" medals. The "hard" golds like the heptathlon, 10000m, Long Jump and Men's Tennis were all won by people who went to comprehensives.<br /><br />With the exception of 1980 and 1984, we've not done well at the Olympics in the hard golds for nearly a century. We've only started doing well in the soft golds by throwing money at competitors, effectively doing the same shit that the DDR did in the 70s that we then considered as cheating.<br /><br />And the policy of selling off school playing fields has always been a disingenuous campaign to poke a stick at Thatcher. In reality, it was about schools selling off excess land. My senior school sold off the bottom of its "levels" and still has a big enough playing space for a game of cricket. It meant they could build a new science block.<br /><br />Tim Almondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13369256383976094670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-37478309877100875952014-06-23T13:01:50.123+01:002014-06-23T13:01:50.123+01:00Apropos, possibly:-
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/wo...Apropos, possibly:-<br /><br />http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/womens-health/10919705/Women-put-off-sport-by-breasts.html<br /><br />And 'of course' men are attracted to women's sport for precisely the same reason.Lolahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04586735342675041312noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-65654527554533768712014-06-23T12:27:50.192+01:002014-06-23T12:27:50.192+01:002) I wonder how much the Great State School playi...2) I wonder how much the Great State School playing field sell-off is responsible for this. Bayardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15211150959757982948noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-47627514667452913422014-06-22T13:31:30.875+01:002014-06-22T13:31:30.875+01:00TS, I think that we are agreeing - as you have co...TS, I think that we are agreeing - as you have confessed to liking (I divine that for your statement that you say you quite liked it) hockey, a competitive team game.<br /><br />This brings me back to my contention that by using ed. vouchers curricula can be set to suit individual preference.Lolahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04586735342675041312noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-2628271060411971052014-06-22T10:50:09.123+01:002014-06-22T10:50:09.123+01:00Lola,
I don't have a problem with physical de...Lola,<br /><br />I don't have a problem with physical development. I enjoyed swimming and walking as a kid. My favourite time doing PE at school was when we had a couple of terms trying sports like judo, hockey and water polo (and I found I was quite good at hockey). Some people may prefer to do ballet which is pretty good physical exercise.Tim Almondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13369256383976094670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-86447575186024595862014-06-21T22:37:07.092+01:002014-06-21T22:37:07.092+01:00FT. I do not accept that. The whole point of spor...FT. I do not accept that. The whole point of sport - especially amateur sport - is that it is, well, pointless. It provides a challenge outside one's other life and often an escape. It can also supply a social life, look at the number of relatively elderly who play bowls.<br /><br />The challenge is the thing. Even for the very best. And for amateurs it is a constant test. I am by no means a 'sportsman' but in the particular discipline that has seduced me it is that, (and beating the other bloke(s)) that is an endless fascination.Lolahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04586735342675041312noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-52927687979950034692014-06-21T22:25:44.774+01:002014-06-21T22:25:44.774+01:00There are good physical development reasons to enc...There are good physical development reasons to encourage running and jumping about by children. I also happen to think that learning 'how to play a [the] game' is a useful bit of life training. But, and it's a big but, I don't think making any subject compulsory is any business at all for the State. It's a denial of liberty. Better to make the MW (endorsed by me) educational voucher thingie a reality in order that school, school curriculum and pupil can be matched. It is perfectly possible to construct a physical training curriculum to suit those who don't like, for example, football (me for instance).<br />Lolahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04586735342675041312noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-51924295470827389372014-06-21T17:33:27.731+01:002014-06-21T17:33:27.731+01:00@The Stigler. Found that Orwell piece:
The Sporti...@The Stigler. Found that Orwell piece: <br /><a href="http://theorwellprize.co.uk/george-orwell/by-orwell/essays-and-other-works/the-sporting-spirit/" rel="nofollow">The Sporting Spirit.</a>Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-84619348233162676412014-06-21T17:18:35.929+01:002014-06-21T17:18:35.929+01:00Mark,
But Argentina mostly succeeded by having Ma...Mark,<br /><br />But Argentina mostly succeeded by having Maradona (and in 1978 by rigging the tournament). You get a player like that, it boosts your chances. Same as Portugal with Figo. <br /><br />That said, the Netherlands does seem to screw with my theory. And I can't explain Spain's dominance of 3 tournaments followed by an unceremonial exit.<br /><br />Russia, China, USA and India aren't into football in a big way. It's definitely growing in the USA, though.<br /><br />Curmudgeon,<br />Yes, but that doesn't mean that consistently, Uruguay does well. From '74 to 2006, they did very little. It's only since Suarez that they've done well.Tim Almondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13369256383976094670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-82064824325166642412014-06-21T16:32:04.955+01:002014-06-21T16:32:04.955+01:00TS
Won Final in 1966;
reached semi-final in 1990 ...TS <br />Won Final in 1966;<br />reached semi-final in 1990 and lost on penalties.<br />2013/14 less than a quarter of Premiership top-four club players were qualified to play for England.<br />Mind you , I enjoyed the way England played especially against Italy.<br />No shame in going out playing with a 4-2-4 formation with four forwards trying to play football.<br />Isn't British sport supposed to produce grace under pressure ; the rueful acceptance of perhaps underserved defeat? "Gentlemanly conduct" figured in the FA rules when I was a referee.Our little lads upfront behaved like gentlemen .(I would have whacked Godin and probably the referee) DBC Reedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17891849727783879145noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-15301213472722230022014-06-21T15:12:33.683+01:002014-06-21T15:12:33.683+01:00"The England team never stands much of chance...<i>"The England team never stands much of chance for simple numeric reasons."</i><br /><br />Uruguay. Cough, cough.<br /><br />And, before anyone pipes up that it was a one-off, I'd bet the current Uruguay team (with Suarez playing) would beat the current England team four times out of five.Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-4200071108045001262014-06-21T15:09:04.022+01:002014-06-21T15:09:04.022+01:00TS, population doesn't have that much impact.
...TS, population doesn't have that much impact.<br /><br />There have only been seven different countries in the World Cup final since 1970:<br /><br />Brazil<br />Italy<br />West Germany/Germany<br />Netherlands<br />Argentina<br />France<br />Spain.<br /><br />Only Brazil has a much larger population than the UK, <br /><br />West Germany, Italy and France are about the same. United Germany is one-third bigger.<br /><br />Spain and Argentina are a bit smaller and Netherlands is a lot smaller.<br /><br />And countries with huge populations like China, USA, Russia, India, Pakistan, Indonesia etc don't do particularly well, do they?Mark Wadsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07733511175178098449noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-32528400848363900622014-06-21T14:15:19.940+01:002014-06-21T14:15:19.940+01:00DBC,
"The results: third raters like Cameron...DBC,<br /><br />"The results: third raters like Cameron Osborne and Boris Johnson, all-purpose monied footlers like those who run the FA and the Premier League where thanks to ruthless laissez faire very few Brit footballers get a game. Obviously talentless footlers better serve the big corporate interest."<br /><br />I've heard this so many times over the past few days, so I challenge you or anyone else to produce the evidence that the England side has performed worse in the 22 years since the premiership was formed (1992-2014) than the 22 years previously (1970-1992).Tim Almondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13369256383976094670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-57306714099674694272014-06-21T13:47:15.453+01:002014-06-21T13:47:15.453+01:00Mark,
The England team never stands much of chanc...Mark,<br /><br />The England team never stands much of chance for simple numeric reasons. We're a smaller population than most winners and when you consider how we also have 2 other team sports we don't have that much chance.<br /><br />You look at the teams that regularly get to world cup final - it's Brazil, Italy and Germany, countries with much bigger populations and without other major team sports.<br /><br />England should have done better than going out in the group rounds, but realistically, we generally go out in Round 2 or the quarter finals. I think we've played badly, but we're rarely that much better, rarely playing more than a scrappy game.Tim Almondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13369256383976094670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-66174852001469575902014-06-21T11:13:11.485+01:002014-06-21T11:13:11.485+01:00MW tries to have it both ways by supporting the sp...MW tries to have it both ways by supporting the sport is trivial argument then makes class based sneers at, presumably, the awful oiks in the England football team.<br />If a rough background is the issue, Luis Suarez fills the bill better by having a really tough upbringing that seems to have done him more good than the comparatively stable early lives of the England stars.<br />I am not slagging off rich kids on a personal basis: I am just saying that national political policy should not be distorted to produce an elite class from inherited wealth (using Picketty's criteria).The results: third raters like Cameron Osborne and Boris Johnson, all-purpose monied footlers like those who run the FA and the Premier League where thanks to ruthless laissez faire very few Brit footballers get a game. Obviously talentless footlers better serve the big corporate interest.<br />The Orwell reference is to the Sporting Spirit a Tribune article<br />marking the visit of the Moscow Dynamoes which was written up to suit the needs of the British militarised state that was turning on its erstwhile allies (who in fact won the war for us).<br />It is a laughable article but is mainly concerned with international sport not non -representative sport in schools.DBC Reedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17891849727783879145noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-58369923411306621332014-06-21T07:43:10.609+01:002014-06-21T07:43:10.609+01:00I can quite proudly say, I held the county record ...I can quite proudly say, I held the county record for, from my first day at school until my last,NEVER having participated in turning the "sport teacher" on, by running around in shorts pretending to chase a ball, or any other form of "equipment."<br /><br />Until the army, I NEVER participated in "sport," And I STILL hate ALL forms of it to this day.<br /><br />Only wankers and queers, or both, "play," or watch, sport.Furor Teutonicushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13856575077967523322noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-40088728425501803452014-06-20T23:47:30.364+01:002014-06-20T23:47:30.364+01:00"the Olympic system of funding is rigged towa...<i>"the Olympic system of funding is rigged towards sports that we're most likely to win something at, which are either obscure sports that no-one cares about winning, including lots of sports with high equipment costs such as yachting, rowing and showjumping that mean you aren't competing with Africans, Jamaicans and Kazakhs."</i><br /><br />So the England football team doesn't stand much of a chance in sunny Brazil this year, does it?<br /><br />DBC can slag off the posh kids all he likes, it's not like t'other end of the social spectrum do us proud, is it? Mark Wadsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07733511175178098449noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-60621665401307154172014-06-20T22:24:43.713+01:002014-06-20T22:24:43.713+01:00I think the point is that private schools get to s... I think the point is that private schools get to spend a lot more on everything than do State schools, so its hardly surprising that they have better sports facilities like astroturf pitches and what have you.Eton's fees are £35,000 pa so its hardly surprising that their rowing set-up was used in the London Olympics.<br />Its the whole concept of private education that's unjust as Alan Bennett has recently explained.You either want to give rich kids a better chance in life or you don't. DBC Reedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17891849727783879145noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-26548032600344616592014-06-20T22:24:42.546+01:002014-06-20T22:24:42.546+01:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.DBC Reedhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17891849727783879145noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-85512863467621025902014-06-20T22:12:53.661+01:002014-06-20T22:12:53.661+01:00paulc,
I didn't know that, but I've only ...paulc,<br /><br />I didn't know that, but I've only read some Orwell and like his writing very much. Do you have a reference?<br /><br />We drink American branded drinks, Australian booze, watch Korean TVs and holiday in France and Spain. International sport, rivalry between nations can feel a bit forced when we're so intertwined. That said, football played at its highest level is a thing of beauty.Tim Almondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13369256383976094670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-59095122923078939962014-06-20T21:43:20.910+01:002014-06-20T21:43:20.910+01:00Agree with that. Orwell linked the rise of school ...Agree with that. Orwell linked the rise of school aports with rise of nationalism in the latter part of the 19thC. It got out of hand somewhere along the way. Frankly, going to football games in the 70's was often little more than tribal warfare. One way or another playing or watching sports can easily substitute for real warfare, which might be a good thing if it didn't actually lead directly to warfare on the odd occasion. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-77895585888893684852014-06-20T20:47:27.601+01:002014-06-20T20:47:27.601+01:00Mark - thanks
Quiet_man - well, OK, but that's...Mark - thanks<br />Quiet_man - well, OK, but that's a pretty low bar<br />Curmudgeon - I didn't get humiliated, I just didn't take part much. I'd always opt for goalkeeper, (which I was actually quite good at), rather than running around after a ball. And the thing of tying it into the Olympics reeks of those old East German programmes.Tim Almondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13369256383976094670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-66200543443837369662014-06-20T18:26:26.863+01:002014-06-20T18:26:26.863+01:00Totally agreed. Sport in school often seems geared...Totally agreed. Sport in school often seems geared to humiliating the kids with less aptitude for it and may put them off any kind of exercise for life.<br /><br />Maths and English are essential life skills. Football isn't.Curmudgeonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02558747878308766840noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-1701988841534855942014-06-20T18:20:36.064+01:002014-06-20T18:20:36.064+01:00Tbh, I'd rather kids did sports than be dragge...Tbh, I'd rather kids did sports than be dragged into mosques to be brainwashed into that religion of peace crap that they appear to be force fed these days.Quiet_Manhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575652127079681825noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-79891680188824060502014-06-20T17:22:53.621+01:002014-06-20T17:22:53.621+01:00Agreed, of course.Agreed, of course.Mark Wadsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07733511175178098449noreply@blogger.com