tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post4334750064603053219..comments2024-03-05T10:52:24.691+00:00Comments on Mark Wadsworth: Town planning: InfrastructureMark Wadsworthhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07733511175178098449noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-49902069606371755512012-12-14T21:26:11.822+00:002012-12-14T21:26:11.822+00:00"No Derek he doesn't do that - he conscri..."No Derek he doesn't do that - he conscripts the plotholders into his army and makes them do it for themselves."<br /><br />Since George II was the last monarch to lead his troops into battle, this is a fairly recent innovation. It's surprising that more didn't end up like Richard III.Bayardhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15211150959757982948noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-18167048909219097512012-12-14T14:14:53.071+00:002012-12-14T14:14:53.071+00:00H, aha, sorry.H, aha, sorry.Mark Wadsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07733511175178098449noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-74744692008550965102012-12-14T12:37:39.590+00:002012-12-14T12:37:39.590+00:00Well, I wasn't trying to disagree!Well, I wasn't trying to disagree! Hhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01146808185620364646noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-9251421321438304062012-12-14T11:53:32.627+00:002012-12-14T11:53:32.627+00:00H, that's the same as my post.
The point bein...H, that's the same as my post.<br /><br />The point being, it is the residents who ultimately create the rental value (being total of consumer and producer suplus) and it is they who pay for the 'infrastucture'. <br /><br />The magnate merely pre-finances some of the infrastructure, but he later makes a profit from user-charges paid by the residents.<br /><br />In a democracy, "the people" are "the monarch", and "the magnates" are pension funds etc (who are supposed to be acting on behalf of lots of small investors). <br /><br />All three roles are actually played by "the people".Mark Wadsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07733511175178098449noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-80701840899905791242012-12-14T11:29:54.011+00:002012-12-14T11:29:54.011+00:00In the middle ages, a local magnate after some ext...In the middle ages, a local magnate after some extra cash would petition the monarch for the right to found a conveniently sited town - say at a road crossing. The magnate would make his money from the ability to charge for occupying the land. The monarch would take a cut from regulating the market and the law courts, plus maybe some taxes. And the inhabitants would be able to work and trade, with the wealthier ones being able to select the mayor and burgesses. Everybody happy. All created simply out of location value and the rule of law.Hhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01146808185620364646noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-20516565496990289952012-12-14T10:50:53.895+00:002012-12-14T10:50:53.895+00:00AKH, 'they' do teach it.
But they whizz ...AKH, 'they' do teach it. <br /><br />But they whizz through the logic and focus on the favoured conclusion: "You can make money by buying land and keeping your fingers crossed that its rental value goes up". <br /><br />It's only if you go through the logic more slowly that somebody tenatively puts his hand up and asks:<br /><br />"So, sir/miss, are you telling us that the producer and consumer surpluses are generated more or less equally by <i>everybody in the area</i>, whether they own land or not? So why do we allow landowners to collect those surpluses that 'everybody else' generates as higher rents?"Mark Wadsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07733511175178098449noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-41570409490692391762012-12-14T10:43:00.719+00:002012-12-14T10:43:00.719+00:00Very compelling. What strikes me about it, is that...Very compelling. What strikes me about it, is that with slightly simpler language you could teach it in schools. <br /><br />It could be an introduction to all kinds of useful ideas, particularly logic.A K Haarthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05897490979828603179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-73344920275459857762012-12-14T10:12:31.315+00:002012-12-14T10:12:31.315+00:00RS, thanks.
Yes, you can have an 'unbounded s...RS, thanks.<br /><br />Yes, you can have an 'unbounded savanah' with option (b) because you can add another 100-plot units to the left or right, above or below and people can then trade with 95 other households instead of 47, nobody loses. <br /><br />If you plonk down another option (b) layout, then the people at the edge of the original village (who originally had access to the outside world) will end up a lot worse off.<br /><br />I stuck in the sentence about camp sites because of what happened at Occupy. <br /><br />You (we) chose a good pitch but other people plonked down their tents willy-nilly and there were no "roads". <br /><br />One day, the "organisers" then had the initiative to re-arrange the tents tighter together in smaller blocks with "roads" in between, so that everybody could get to their tents without stumbling over other tents in the dark. <br /><br />Basic slum clearance, so to speak. Everybody wins.Mark Wadsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07733511175178098449noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-60353921277995575152012-12-14T09:35:26.785+00:002012-12-14T09:35:26.785+00:00This is brilliant. Have you read The Unbounded Sav...This is brilliant. Have you read The Unbounded Savannah: http://www.henrygeorge.org/pchp19.htm<br /><br />Only a complete twat would deny any of your logic. <br /><br />The question is - most people in the world today DO deny it.<br /><br />What are we going to do about that?<br /><br />Would it be better to put our efforts into figuring THAT out than going over old ground time and again. Its 'completed work'.<br /><br />Caveat: I'm not knocking your superb analysis. I am asking you to move on to more innovative ground.<br /><br />The RSI Real Reform: http://gco2e.blogspot.co.uk/<br /><br />Join us to talk about this at the TERC, every Friday evening, 530, The Brewmaster, Leicester Sq. RSVP.Robin Smithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04648517992918303543noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-8529622662055625832012-12-14T07:29:53.777+00:002012-12-14T07:29:53.777+00:00BJ, you've sent everybody off a tangent now.
...BJ, you've sent everybody off a tangent now. <br /><br />D, defence is something else which people have to/are happy to pay for, even if it means volunteering. Conversely, going round attacking other countries should be entirely voluntary and preferably on a for-profit basis (which means that wars of invasion would never happen - too expensive).<br /><br />W42, of course we can squeeze in more houses on the green areas, this post wasn't about the precise geometry of it, it was that infrastructure is self financing.Mark Wadsworthhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07733511175178098449noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-68682328524242112232012-12-14T02:31:53.251+00:002012-12-14T02:31:53.251+00:00Fair point, Woodsy. But even if they had an Owners...Fair point, Woodsy. But even if they had an Owners Association instead of a monarch they would still have to repel incursions themselves. And chances are fair that some of them would free-ride if the Association, monarch or whatever didn't have the power to point out that anyone who didn't help the defence effort would have their plot title put up for public auction.<br /><br />As for making them invade other caravan sites, we're back to Evil Overlords again. It's a possibility but that's life.<br />Derekhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06296053477905542366noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-22382942285218083952012-12-14T01:13:13.821+00:002012-12-14T01:13:13.821+00:00"nd repelling incursions from neighbouring 10..."nd repelling incursions from neighbouring 100 plot "<br /><br />No Derek he doesn't do that - he conscripts the plotholders into his army and makes them do it for themselves. <br />In fact sometimes he makes them fight people who aren't even planning an incursion.<br />(Hopefully not if the plan is a caravan park)<br /><br />Incidentally Mark you can get another accessible plot in plan b by using the central play area differently. More profit that way :-)Woodsy42https://www.blogger.com/profile/12355671210161625647noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-14349224195530341312012-12-14T00:43:58.157+00:002012-12-14T00:43:58.157+00:00At base that's what a monarch's function i...At base that's what a monarch's function is: to keep the peace. If he's acting as a Judge and settling squabbles between neighbours; upholding everyone's purchased right to exclusive enjoyment of their plot without everyone else trespassing all over it; arbitrating contract disputes, etc; or if he's acting as a Defender and repelling incursions from neighbouring 100 plot despots then he's providing a service worth having.<br /><br />Whether he's doing that for a reasonable price is another matter of course. But that's all part of what separates a Benevolent Dictator from an Evil Overlord I suppose.<br />Derekhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06296053477905542366noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1141932539860553199.post-46179311242025559832012-12-13T22:57:04.136+00:002012-12-13T22:57:04.136+00:00A large army to help keep the peace?
Oh, that'...A large army to help keep the peace?<br /><br />Oh, that's not quite factually correct is it? There haven't been too many Monarchs or Dictators that haven't used their armies to "expand" their rental incomes have there? benjhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11544297406005346095noreply@blogger.com